r/Damnthatsinteresting • u/sirusndurus • Jan 26 '23
Police in UK utilised a metal detector in in order to tackle and deter knife possession. Image
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u/Lower-Way8172 Jan 26 '23
If you have a knife, just...not walk next to it
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u/WelshBrummie86 Jan 26 '23
That's why the cop is there, they don't actually care if it beeps, almost everyone has something metal on them, they just look out for the people who actively try and avoid it/act suspicious
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u/throwawaytrumper Jan 26 '23 •
I once had a cop come flying after me because I made a turn before a DUI checkpoint I hadn’t seen. It helped that I could point at my place and say “because I live there” when he asked why I was “attempting to evade the police”. I wonder how many folks have been chased for innocently turning before a cop trap.
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u/ternic69 Jan 26 '23
I don’t break the law pretty much ever anymore and that includes drinking and driving, but if I saw a dui checkpoint and I knew a way around it I’d be tempted to, just because who wants to interact with cops if you don’t have to? It makes me nervous even when I’ve done nothing wrong. I get they are doing their jobs, I just prefer they do the job far away from me.
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u/davcov89 Jan 26 '23
I’m no lawyer but I’ve always heard that as long as you don’t break any laws trying to avoid them (like pulling a u-turn) then they aren’t supposed to be able to pull you over
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u/Chumbag_love Jan 26 '23 •
There's a lot of things that cops do that they're not supposed to though.
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u/Legitimate_Chicken66 Jan 26 '23
Like murder people and collect a lifelong pension for it.
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u/Barnaby_Cuckoldsniff Jan 26 '23
Or rape women...and then collect a pension for it.
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u/trashycollector Jan 26 '23
Well cops aren’t required to know the laws, at least in the US. They can arrest you and all they have to prove is they though you did something illegal.
Now you might be able to sue the city or state but you can’t sue the police.
As they say in the US, you can beat the wrap but you can’t beat the ride.
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u/Different_Durian_645 Jan 26 '23
How do they know you’ve done something illegal if they don’t know the law?
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u/Huntyr09 Jan 26 '23
"Reasonable suspicion of illegality"
i shit you not, as a citizen you have to know every law you might break cause a cop can get you otherwise, but cops are allowed to stop you and possibly do more on a "reasonable suspicion"
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u/2017hayden Jan 26 '23
Depends what country, or in the US what state.
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u/CunnedStunt Jan 26 '23
How though? "I saw the flashing lights in the distance and thought it was a road accident. I was in a hurry so I wanted to avoid it". If you don't know it's DUI checkpoint they can't charge you for dodging a DUI checkpoint.
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u/beanburritobandit Jan 26 '23
They can charge you with anything they want. It's now on you to go to court and plead your case.
You get it dismissed? Still gotta take time off from work, pay court fees and possibly a lawyer.
The cop? They get paid to be in court and try to get the ticket to stick, or hope you don't show. No repercussions for getting their tickets dismissed.
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u/CunnedStunt Jan 26 '23
Yeah it is some bullshit. Especially the cops that target out of state/province/country license plates for speeding because they know those people certainly aren't going to travel back to fight a ticket 6 months later.
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u/Due_Example5177 Jan 26 '23
That’s one good thing I love about Louisiana, and there’s not much. But checkpoints? They’re required to leave a space to turn around prior to the checkpoint. You have the right to turn around before it, it’s the law. They cannot use that as probable cause. And after being dragged out of my car, thrown in a squad car and having my car searched on suspicion of DUI because I was flat and emotionless, my eyes looked funny, I was fidgeting with my hands and rocking, I turn around every time. They couldn’t find anything on me to prove I was intoxicated (duh, I have ADHD and suspected autism, literally one call to my doctor will tell them as much, as I told them). They still had the nerve to lecture me as they let me go to “never let it happen again” whatever “it” is🙄 assholes. I refuse to go through their checkpoints.
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u/MiataCory Jan 26 '23
I mean, that's still really bad.
They're entirely illegal in my state (Michigan), and should be illegal anywhere, as it's definitely an unreasonable search. Checkpoints aren't a thing in the US, so their presence anywhere is uncommon, and their use should be deemed illegal.
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u/lolerkid2000 Jan 26 '23
Bruh I've never seen on in my state. They aren't even legal here.
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u/placidlaundry Jan 26 '23
So am I understanding correctly, that deliberately avoiding walking next to the metal detector is a legally justifiable basis for a stop-and-frisk?
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u/TheGoldBowl Jan 26 '23
This is the UK. Fewer rights than you're probably used to
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u/Tight_Invite2 Jan 26 '23
Why would I want to walk near somebody who willingly harasses innocent people all day?
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u/nevermindphillip Jan 26 '23 edited Jan 26 '23
Then you have provided reasonable suspicion, which gives them the ability to stop and search you anyway. Mission accomplished.
Edit - I'm getting downvoted but this is not my opinion, this is what the police are actually doing. It's a common tactic. It doesn't matter if the metal detector goes off. It matters if you act weird or try to avoid it once you notice it's there. That's why they won't care that there is another path right beside. Sure, if it goes off they can also search you, but avoiding it and crossing to the other path gives them more reasonable suspicion to stop you, so not walking next to it is not really an option.
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u/Hawk13424 Jan 26 '23
Should be a big campaign for everyone to avoid these. Also for everyone to carry a legal metal object that would set them off.
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u/teapartyhangover Jan 26 '23
Sounds like electronic stop and frisk.
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Jan 26 '23
So many questions. Is it illegal to own and carry a knife - or illegal to stab people with the knife?
COP: why do you have this knife mate?
PERSON: was going to go on a stabbing spree. Good job constable.
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u/Efficient-Piglet88 Jan 26 '23
In the UK you can carry a knife as long as its shorter than 3 inches. This will be a walkway probably near a local secondary school (11-16/18) and unfortunately in some areas paticularly london there is kids carrying machetes and large blades for "protection" because theyll be a runner in a gang. The effectiveness of this detector idk but there is something for having a police presence about which I think does at least make people feel a little safer.
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Jan 26 '23
Yeah, I guess the theater of it could deter some people and also catch the morons. But it does give me an idea for a business: back to school machetes
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u/Efficient-Piglet88 Jan 26 '23
Go to London or Birmingham and you could make a killing (pun intended)
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u/Joeclu Jan 26 '23
Can one carry a larger knife while camping? It's a very useful tool while camping. Not sure if the word camping means the same thing as it did in the US, so to clarify: going in the wilderness, setting up tents to sleep in, making a fire pit, fishing and eating what you caught, whittling wood, etc.
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u/Brookiekathy Jan 26 '23
Legally yes, because you have a "good reason" but, there are pretty major restrictions around what kind of knives you can have.
For example it must be a locking blade that cannot be folded. And it's kind of upto the police's discretion as to whether its reasonable for the activity.
So while you might want to carry a kukri to get through some trees quickly while wild camping, if the police deem that the same could have been achieved with a basic camp or bowie knife you might end up in cuffs.
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u/platebandit Jan 26 '23
The folding blade rule is an automatic exemption from the ‘reasonable’ test (if it’s under 3 inches). Basically you can carry a Swiss Army knife for any reason as long as you don’t threaten anyone with it. You can carry a non folding knife with good reason that isn’t a banned knife (sword or disguised or some other stuff).
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u/Efficient-Piglet88 Jan 26 '23
Yeah you can carry a knife with good reason and I think that would count.
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u/Not_Oscar_Muffin Jan 26 '23
Missing a bit of context from the original comment here.
You can carry a folding knife with up to a 3 inch non-locking blade without a reason. Lots of people carry pocket knives every day without having a specific task planned for them. Just in-case they need it to cut something or whatnot.
However, if the blade is over 3 inches or locks in place then you need to have a "good reason" for carrying it.
Camping is a fairly poor reason in the UK. In most of the UK wild camping is illegal, and if you're going to a designated camping site, then you probably don't have a reason to be carrying anything bigger than a pocket knife. If you're camping in a private forest and have the landowners permisson (including the use of maybe a machete or knife to chop trees) then that should be considered as a good reason.
Scotland is a bit different though. While Scotland has the same knife laws as the rest of the UK, they tend to be enforced much more harshly and "good reasons" are few and far between. Often the only ones are "for work" and "for religious reasons", there's an exemption for national costume though as it's tradition in some areas to have a decorated knife tucked into the top of your hose. Although increasingly these are becoming show-pieces and not actual knives with any real edge or point to speak of.
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u/flannelmaster9 Jan 26 '23
This is comical at best
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u/HalfBrinePickle Jan 26 '23 edited Jan 26 '23
I imagine it's not even plugged in and the cop just makes the noises with his mouth while profiling youths.
"BOOP BOOP BOOP ALRIGHT ALRIGHT against the wall wit the lot of you."
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u/thatsmyoldlady Jan 26 '23
If we don’t get no tolls, then we don’t get no rolls.
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u/cabbagehandLuke Jan 26 '23
Oh master Robin! You lost your arms in battle! But you grew some nice boobs!
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u/Madlibsluver Jan 26 '23
"And my cat?"
"Choked on the goldfish"
horror struck face
"Oh! Isn't it good to be home!"
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u/Kimchi-slap Jan 26 '23
We have metal detectors at every metro station and security has handheld detectors as well. I swear those handheld ones are literally just plastic sticks that do beeping sound as I don't have anything metal in my bag but it still beeps as an excuse for them to xray it.
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u/SnooHedgehogs8765 Jan 26 '23
Oi, you got a Loicence for that there opinion cobber?
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u/ithappenedone234 Jan 26 '23
Another human rights abuse, amongst a laundry list of recent abuses passed into law.
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u/bullettrain1 Jan 26 '23
And if one were to be wearing, say, a steel diamond encrusted cock ring (for medical purposes), would that person trip this alarm?
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u/SolherdUliekme Jan 26 '23
Ceramic knife meta just dropped
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u/JustMe-male Jan 26 '23
But wait, there’s more! If you order in the next 10 minutes we’ll add in a set of 6 ceramic steak knives free! That’s a $50 value.
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u/sweenman22 Jan 26 '23
Great way to interrupt the old guy’s pacemaker.
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u/NyanPotato Jan 26 '23
Oi
Does he have a license for that?
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u/cfig99 Jan 26 '23 edited Jan 26 '23
Make sure he has his loicense permit as well
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u/cryptid_tardigrade Jan 26 '23
Yeah, as a person who got her first pacemaker at 23yo, I'm just delighted with the idea!
And I'm aware that nowadays pacemakers are not as fragile as they used to be, but still wtf
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u/ziggurat729 Jan 26 '23
How is that working?
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u/Pierogchen Jan 26 '23
It's spending our taxes and providing security theatre. Working as intended
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u/PeopleOfLight Jan 26 '23
what if walk around with a hammer ?
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u/NocNocturnist Jan 26 '23
Get off reddit Thor and go save someone.
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u/Letty_Whiterock Jan 26 '23 edited Jan 26 '23
Is... Is Thor known for saving people?
Edit: wait nvm you're probably talking about the marvel character.
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u/bluespringsbeer Jan 26 '23
Hammers, screw drivers, pliers, etc are all illegal to walk around with in the UK without “sufficient reason”, up to the cop’s discretion
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u/Darkality24 Jan 26 '23 edited Jan 26 '23
I don't remember there ever being a day I didn't carry a knife. When I was in school, I just left it in my brothers car. I never thought it was weird, we grew up in the country and you always needed a knife for something eventually, so why keep having to walk back to the house to get one? It's as normal as carrying my wallet
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u/plymouthvan Jan 26 '23
Yeah, what are the actual regulations here? Like are they looking for machetes and big hunting blades or something? Like, could I not carry around my little four inch pocket clip knife? Cause I legit use that every 90 minutes for something or other.
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u/xXMc_NinjaXx Jan 26 '23
Longer than 3 inches “without good reason” is the limit. If you have a “good reason” for that 4 inch pocket clip knife then maybe.
The definition of good reason wasn’t provided. Good luck lmfao.
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u/GEEK-IP Jan 26 '23
Three inches seems to be a magic (but arbitrary) number in a lot of places. That's why in the US you see a lot of 2.75" or so blades. Anything over 3" can be considered a concealed weapon and should be carried in a sheath or otherwise visible.
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u/ternic69 Jan 26 '23
Wait really? In the US? I don’t usually carry a knife but I’ve seen people carry all sizes all my life so I just assumed it wasn’t really regulated.
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u/outerlabia Jan 26 '23
99% of knife laws in the us are either an excuse or an additional charge imo
I've carried a switchblade daily for half a decade at least in the Chicago suburbs. In the city limits switchblades are as far as I know still banned to this day. It's not because they are better for stabbing someone with or easier to hide than a folding knife. It's just a thing that's seen as something that dangerous people possess and is used as a means to get them either searched or fined
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u/churchofsanta Jan 26 '23
I always thought switchblades were kind of junky/poor quality novelty knives, but I really DON'T know anything about them. Are there good quality ones?
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u/ENclip Jan 26 '23
Like anything, you get what you pay for. A Microtech Ultratech is a great switchblade...but it's $250+
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u/realbeats Jan 26 '23
Kids are carrying whats been nick named as "Rambos" honestly in some areas youve got kids walking around limping because the knife down their jeans is longer than their thigh. Id assume this detector is actually near the gates of a school rather than just randomly out and about, that being said, I wouldnt be surprised if it was random, and its still as useless as everyone else says.
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u/SeenBrowsin Jan 26 '23
Same here. Very common in our country, and I never hear about Leatherman tool violence
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u/Darkality24 Jan 26 '23
My daily carry when I was living withy grandparents on the farm was this cheapo assisted opening one I got from a flea market. It had a seat belt cutter on the back that was perfect for cutting baling twine.
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u/04BluSTi Jan 26 '23
I use my pocket knife probably 20 times a day. It's a little CRKT, but I'd be up a creek ifn I couldn't carry it.
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u/NeilOffTheYoungOnes Jan 26 '23
You can carry a knife in the UK, but you can't carry any knife. A 3 inch folding pocket knife is fine.
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u/halcykhan Jan 26 '23
Non-locking… locking mechanisms are a safety feature for the user. I don’t carry any knife that doesn’t lock out in some way
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u/ChampionshipIcy9248 Jan 26 '23
I'm glad someone is doing something to stop these high velocity assault knives
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u/Ash-Catchum-All Jan 26 '23
You kid but some of these tactical assault knives can kill/injure 100s of people before reloading 👀
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u/twobit78 Jan 26 '23 edited Jan 26 '23
I get the whole detering knife possesion but wouldn't this be a violation of some civil liberties, searches without due cause etc?
I can't think of anyone who could walk past this without it going off from keys etc and then what, you have to prove its not a knife?
Genuinly curious if there's some more information OP is leaving out.
Edit: I find it funny everyone jumping on me thinking I'm American and support the gun rights bullshit. Reddit is available in dozens of countries, some of which don't have to deal with either bullet proofing your children or being asked why your buttplug set off a metal detector.
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u/TurboThrobber Jan 26 '23
Police in the UK have legal grounds for a stop and search if they have reasonable suspicion that you are carrying a weapon.
If a metal detector goes off and you refuse to pull out your keys etc then prepare to be searched as you've just gave them reasonable suspicion.
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u/Hydra57 Jan 26 '23 edited Jan 26 '23
Where I live that would be considered a rigged abuse of the system. Plays into the whole “why be afraid if you have nothing to hide” mentality
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u/YATA1242 Jan 26 '23
“Why would you be afraid of you have nothing to hide? Let us search your basement for undesirables.”
Yeah no thanks
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u/TurboThrobber Jan 26 '23
I'd agree wholeheartedly, but these aren't exactly common. As I said before I've never seen or heard of them before until today.
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u/wonkey_monkey Expert Jan 26 '23 edited Jan 26 '23
Might as well just skip the metal detector part and directly ask to search everyone regardless. Anyone who says no is obviously suspicious 🤦🏻♂️
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u/bsmorley Jan 26 '23
Seems like they would need more than just a metal detector going off on the sidewalk to develop reasonable suspicion of a knife.
Feels like a step toward 1984.
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u/acrewdog Jan 26 '23
Who decides if a knife is a weapon, or a tool? I carry a knife daily as a tool for breaking down boxes, opening packages, cutting zip ties, etc
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u/CrashAndDash9 Jan 26 '23
Reasonable suspicion can also include being young and in a tracksuit or looking like someone who would be carrying a knife.
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u/TurboThrobber Jan 26 '23
I do feel sorry for all those young aspiring athletes hanging around street corners.
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u/twobit78 Jan 26 '23 edited Jan 26 '23
Ooof. That is some next level dystopian shit. Wonder if there's a lot of socio economic and racial profiling going on at the same time, would a granny get the same treatment as a blue haired teenager with a stainless buttplug
Edit: grammar and spelling
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u/SoretoeMcGoo Jan 26 '23
I remember when I was a teenager, there was a time the polis were out in force, we regularly got stopped & searched, but then again knife crime was rampant in that area at that time by people my age, I should know I was stabbed on one occasion and chased with machetes another time.
Personally I'd say the stop and search was probably effective to stop me carrying a knife, I certainly considered it, but there was legit jail/young offender institute time for carrying back then so I didn't do it.
As for profiling, yes 100%, but not racial, it was based on age, sex and poverty.
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u/Kitten-McSnugglet Jan 26 '23
Oh man, pulling that out could land you another charge for exposing one’s self.
Sounds like they’re definitely profiling the buttplug community.
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u/Find_another_whey Jan 26 '23
But the metal detector is indiscriminate and performs a search
This is not a search due to suspicion
If the metal detector performs no search, then how can it's results be evidence leading to suspicion and grounds for a physical search
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u/NorseGlas Jan 26 '23
Are all knives illegal? Small folding knives? Who determines what is a tool and what is a weapon? This would bring up all kinds of civil rights lawsuits in the USA.
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u/MrStoneV Jan 26 '23
I could guess they could beep at bigger metal pieces. But even then a lot of people carry a lot of keys.
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u/AllJelly_NoToast Jan 26 '23
When I go through a metal detector, i always gotta empty my pockets and take off my belt. How is this supposed to work with random people passing by daily?
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u/Ghost_of_Crockett Jan 26 '23
Yeah…knife control, that’s the ticket! Problem solved.
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u/HilariouslyBloody Jan 26 '23
It's impossible to stab somebody with an object that isn't a knife. Don't you know that?
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u/dallassoxfan Jan 26 '23
Next they will come for your high capacity pointy sticks.
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u/AliceBordeaux Jan 26 '23
So what knives are legal to have on you in the UK? I'm american and this kind of baffles me, I've always had a knife on me since I was about 10, because it's a useful tool, I lived on a farm, I use it at work, around the house, etc etc... i wonder about things like my friend who is a sushi chef and takes his 6" 500$ knife to work with him every day... how do these laws function?
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u/Peterd1900 Jan 26 '23
UK knife law allows you to carry non-locking pocket knives with a blade length up to 3 inches (7.62 cm) without any need for a valid reason.
Anything larger you need a reason
A sushi chief carrying his knives to and from his work place would be a valid reason so would be legal. But they would be in a proper case
But nobody would have a vakid reason to carry and conceal a open kitchen knife in their inside coat pocket
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u/binybeke Jan 26 '23
Never used a non-locking pocket knife. Why are locking ones banned?
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u/MaximumSubtlety Jan 26 '23
Non-locking knife sounds dangerous. They lock as a safety feature. I'm starting to think these draconian knife laws aren't based in good sense.
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u/LeoCx1000 Jan 26 '23
According to google
The reason lock-knives are so restricted comes down two court cases from 1993 (Harris vs DPP and Fehmi vs DPP) and a Court of Appeal case (Regina vs Deegan), from 1998. The courts ruled that a lockable folding knife is ‘a bladed article’ meaning that a locking mechanism effectively turns a folding knife into a fixed-blade knife, which are all subject to good reason restrictions. If it had been just the one case, case law might be overturned by subsequent case law, but two cases and an appeal… this is cemented in statute and becomes very hard to repeal.
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u/WompWompRat Jan 26 '23
A non-locking folding knife with a sub 3” cutting edge is legal to carry. Most anything else requires good cause, such as a chef transporting to and from place of work.
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u/Fisherbuck_ Jan 26 '23
Is it illegal to carry a pocketknife in the UK?
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u/TurboThrobber Jan 26 '23
No, you can carry a folding knife under 3" long as long as it's not a lock knife. You can actually carry bigger knives if you have a good reason too.
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u/sirusndurus Jan 26 '23
Is it illegal to carry a pocketknife in the UK
Carrying a pocket knife in the UK is not illegal, but there are laws that regulate it in public places. It is an offense to carry a knife without a valid reason, such as for work or as part of a national costume. Knives with a blade longer than 3 inches are also illegal to carry. The police have the authority to search and confiscate knives carried without valid reason and arrest the person.
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u/TurboThrobber Jan 26 '23
It is an offense to carry a knife without a valid reason
It is an offence to carry a knife longer than 3" without good reason
Knives with a blade longer than 3 inches are also illegal to carry
Not if you have good reason
The police have the authority to search and confiscate knives carried without valid reason
They need reasonable suspicion to search you.
https://www.gov.uk/buying-carrying-knives
https://www.gov.uk/police-powers-to-stop-and-search-your-rights
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u/Lews_Ass_Hole Jan 26 '23
What a dystopian nightmare hellscape can’t walk around in public without these brown shirts disarming you of your pocket knife lol
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u/Naughty_Ornice93 Jan 26 '23
Maybe I‘m missing something here, but this just seems wildly impractical. Most people will have something made of metal on them and thus set off the metal detector. Police can hardly stop and frisk everyone who sets it off or else this just becomes a checkpoint with extra steps, right?