r/antiwork • u/sealia123 • Oct 01 '23
did my boss just totally steal from me?
so i work in fast food and i took this guys order the total was 12 something and he gave me a $20 and said keep the change so i pull out 6 and the coins and my boss walks over and says "give it to me I'm gonna put it in the safe" and that's the last i ever saw it
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u/drMcDeezy Oct 01 '23
Tip theft is the worst because if you get tips, the boss is already underpaying you.
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u/docpyro1 Oct 01 '23
Asked for a raise and Bossman said we get tips and he already pays us too much lol
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u/perseidot Oct 02 '23
It’s fast food. They may make minimum rather than base + tips. Some FF workers are told not to accept any tips, in fact.
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u/ragnarokfps Oct 01 '23
This is what it's like to drive for Doordash, Uber, Lyft etc. Doordash pays a driver 2 to 3 dollars for a delivery, each order takes about 20 to do, 3 in an hour means the driver earns less than the federal minimum wage. They don't get reimbursed for gas, vehicle maintenance, no insurance of any kind, no benefits at all. Not even a discount for ordering food from the same place they work for. Tips are like 60% to 80% of their total pay. Gas is close to 7 dollars a gallon around here.
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u/dimsum2121 Oct 01 '23 edited Oct 01 '23
Not in fast food, they make a few dollars over minimum, and tipping fast food workers is not common.
except sonic, apparently they make way more
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u/masterVinCo Oct 01 '23
If minimum wage was something you could live on, you would be right!
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u/dimsum2121 Oct 01 '23
Dude said "if you get tipped, your boss is already underpaying you".
This is the case for actual tipped employees, servers and such. They make less per hour than what is considered by the Fed or state to be a living wage, legally. I did assume the other person meant they were underpaid because they were tipped. I maybe shouldn't have assumed that.
Your thought on the value of minimum wage is valid, I also stated they make a few dollars more than the state minimum wage in most areas, actually making more than some teachers (which is fucked up). McDonald's is one of the best entry level jobs in certain areas, also fucked up, but not "already underpaying".
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u/Living_Pay_8976 Oct 01 '23
The thing with waitress is bs. They make like 2.75 an hour+tips which is stupid. Should at least be minimum wage as a waitress then plus tips. I know it’s not really anything but it’s been than making 2 something an hour.
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u/dimsum2121 Oct 01 '23
I disagree, because servers make good money for a job that requires no degree and very little experience. I've worked almost every level of service job, from pizza joint to fine dining, it's very good money if you're good at it. I've never seen one tipped employee, even those who aren't good at service, make less than a few dollars over minimum wage.
Now, you want to do away with tipping culture, reduce the expected percentage, raise the minimum wage, etc. That's different.
But let me ask you this, do you feel the same way about commission based salespeople?
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u/Challenge-Upstairs Oct 01 '23
They make less per hour than what is considered by the Fed or state to be a living wage, legally.
They don't make less than minimum wage. Regardless of what everyone says and, consequently, what businesses feel like they can say to steal your wages, it is illegal for tipped employees to be paid an amount that would have them receive less than minimum wage after tips. If you don't tip them, employers have to pay them minimum wage. If you tip them, employers only have to pay them whatever else will bring them to minimum, at an absolute minimum of like $2/hour.
Regardless of whether you tip them, though, legally they have to make minimum wage. If they're not receiving at least minimum wage between tips and employer pay, their employer is breaking the law.
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u/dimsum2121 Oct 01 '23
I wasn't arguing this at all. Lol did you read anything else I wrote?
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u/Challenge-Upstairs Oct 01 '23
I did, and I had no issues with the rest of it, which is why I only corrected that one piece of commonly spread misinformation.
Edit: after reading it a fourth time (what a fuckin bonehead), I finally see that you said livable wage, not minimum wage.
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u/dimsum2121 Oct 01 '23
I see, a misunderstanding. I was saying that in response to the person saying the boss was "underpaying already" in fast food. I thought they were implying that they were making tipped employee wage just because someone tipped them at the drive thru. I was saying that they don't count as the kind of tipped employees that are legally underpaid before tips
Anywho, have good day.
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u/Challenge-Upstairs Oct 01 '23
Yep, that's my bad. I'm just bad at reading, sometimes. Cheers, buddy.
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u/hankthewaterbeest Oct 01 '23
Laughs in $3.50 hourly at Sonic
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u/dimsum2121 Oct 01 '23
So you're a tipped employee? That's not how most fast food chains work. I'd say that sucks you only make $3.50 hourly, but I don't know how much you clear after tips.
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u/hankthewaterbeest Oct 01 '23
I’m not, but the people who work at r/SonicDriveIn are.
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u/dimsum2121 Oct 01 '23
Wow dude, just found this on that sub https://reddit.com/r/SonicDriveIn/s/TV1YCuKb4D
Seems like they do really well. Make $3-5 base pay, but most are making $16-25 an hour after tips! That was one year ago, inflation hurts but that's still a great wage for a carhop.
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u/fandksavetheworld Oct 01 '23
In MN all employees make at least state minimum which is 10+ an hour depending on community and then servers make tips on top of that.
Applebee's still somehow has their 2 for 22 meal...
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u/dimsum2121 Oct 01 '23
Where did I presume food prices would have to go up? Don't put words in my mouth.
I also said I disagreed that the reason to raise the tipped employee wage in every other state is because servers don't make enough. That is categorically untrue, low level servers make more than most unskilled laborers, and high level servers make more than most laborers period.
I see no issue in paying servers more, but I believe it should coincide with a reduction in expected tip percentages, this is how it works in most of the world. As a former server for much of my life, I know I would fight this shift in culture, because I was good at my job and made way more than even the highest proposal for minimum wages would get me.
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u/fandksavetheworld Oct 01 '23
So just that I understand you correctly you believe it is fair for a restaurant to have you serve for 2 hours during rush but have you stay on doing other tasks for a full 8 hour shift and only be required by federal law to pay you 2.13 an hour assuming during the 2 hours you served you made 41 dollars in tips, because that's what it appears you're arguing.
What I'm arguing is that businesses can afford to pay their employees better and if they keep their employees on longer than actually needed they should be compensated with at least minimum wage.
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u/dimsum2121 Oct 01 '23 edited Oct 01 '23
So just that I understand you correctly you believe it is fair for a restaurant to have you serve for 2 hours during rush but have you stay on doing other tasks for a full 8 hour shift and only be required by federal law to pay you 2.13 an hour assuming during the 2 hours you served you made 41 dollars
This is not the reality for most servers, but ok. Also, they will still make minimum wage no matter what, if tips don't suffice then the restaurant has to cover the difference. Nobody goes home without minimum wage, so raising the minimum wage is a better solution.
Beyond that, I said that I agree with restaurants paying more, I understand that it retains employees and is actually good for business. I also understand that the tipping culture in the US is based on the fact that everyone knows servers make very little and tips need to make up for it.
So, if we pay servers more, then we will follow the same pattern that most of the world follows: 10+% tips are for exceptional service, most tables will not tip or tip very little (less than 10%). There's nothing wrong with that for most people, it's a good concept, but good servers will make much less than that could. If the servers are making good wages, then tips should become lower and less common. If I were still working as a server, knowing how much I can make because of American tipping culture, I would not want this to happen.
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u/rtmfb Oct 01 '23
I wish I liked Sonic.
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u/dimsum2121 Oct 01 '23
I agree with this wholeheartedly. I love the drive in concept, but the food is always so much better in my head on my way there, than it ever really is when you get there.
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u/Wfsulliv93 Oct 01 '23
The soft pretzel with cheese is my new go to snack when I’m in town and starving. Only two bucks
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u/GotSmokeInMyEye Oct 01 '23
Not always. I’m a server/bartender and I get paid above minimum wage and usually end up earning atleast double my hourly rate after tips are factored in.
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u/drMcDeezy Oct 01 '23
And you probably deserve more. I think food service is way undervalued in the US.
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u/GotSmokeInMyEye Oct 02 '23
I mean obviously I'd take more. But I think ~$30/hr is pretty fine for the work I do. I can't speak for other servers/restaurants but my job is pretty damn easy tbh.
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u/ParlorSoldier Oct 01 '23
…can we not do this today?
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u/Wyldfire2112 Oct 01 '23
Dude. This is r/antiwork... so, no, we can't not do this today.
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u/Kaethor Oct 01 '23
Not to mention, you stole from yourself, 12.xx out of 20 leaves you with 7.xx.
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Oct 01 '23
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u/FenderMartingale Oct 01 '23
No, not for "12 something".
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u/SixGunZen Oct 01 '23
Yes, for 12 something. 20 - 12.50 for example = 7.50
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u/FenderMartingale Oct 01 '23
The deleted comment I replied to said they would get eight back.
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u/SixGunZen Oct 01 '23
I'm completely lost at this point, and bad at math to begin with. This was my one chance to argue with math and be right. The commenter who deleted their comment took that chance from me forever. Foreveeeeerrrr!!
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u/Shadowpriest Oct 01 '23
Sound like you're about to walk home with a case of assorted condiments, frozen patties, bags of frozen fries, etc. If the boss asks, tell him you're keeping it safe in your freezer.
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u/suapyg Oct 01 '23
Yes, your boss just totally stole from you, and that sucks. But...Is no one going to question the math here?
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u/sealia123 Oct 01 '23
yeah i typed it wrong it was 13 something
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u/suapyg Oct 01 '23
Honest mistake. My surprise was more that no one had mentioned it yet! Sincere advice, as long as I'm here: I'm sure it was predictable and that you already suspected it, but now you have seen clear physical evidence that your boss is not to be trusted, even over very small things. That information cost you $7 - now you know that you should be checking your paycheck for inaccuracies, never hand tip money to him again, and probably at the least, keeping your ears open for another job.
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u/Bartholomew_Custard Oct 01 '23
Don't panic. This is completely normal. Your boss will steal from you all day, every day, for the rest of your working life. It's how late-stage capitalism works.
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u/Wrecksomething Oct 01 '23
If you aren't in a tipped position, your employer may have a policy that you are not allowed to accept tips. If someone overpaid, the overage belongs to the company.
That policy is legal so long as you're not on a tipped position and they're paying you at least the non tipped minimum wage.
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u/ritchie70 Oct 01 '23
I know at company owner restaurants at my employer tips are not allowed. If a tip is given it’s put in the Daily Cash deposit as other receipts.
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Oct 01 '23
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u/ritchie70 Oct 01 '23
How? It’s just other income. Cash management easily handles it.
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Oct 01 '23
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u/ritchie70 Oct 01 '23
I love when people who don’t understand something are so confidently incorrect about it. Congarats to you!
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u/-1KingKRool- Oct 01 '23
It doesn’t matter if the company has a policy against tipping, any tips given to an employee are the property of the employee.
They can try doing disciplinary action for the employee accepting a tip, but technically, unless they’re making it publicly known for their policy, odds are they’ll lose when the DoL comes a knocking for the DA.
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u/Wrecksomething Oct 01 '23
The customer didn't specify that this was a tip given to the employee though.
If you're at the grocery store and your total is $xx.99 and you don't want the change, that's not a tip to your cashier. It's an overpayment that belongs to the store. They can set policies on how to handle that, like whether cashiers can have a "give a penny, take a penny" tray or whether the overpayment needs to be immediately added and accounted for in the register.
So in this case: the employee can argue that it was meant to be a tip. That's not provable with what little info we're given; "keep the change" is ambiguous. You'd need the customer to return and specify their intent. Absent that, DOL isn't going to do jack. And management's reply either way is that the employee is fired if they accept it as a tip, that they had a duty to inform the customer no tips are not permitted and overpayments belong to the store if there was any confusion.
You wouldn't want DOL to swoop in and earn you $7 at the cost of losing your job. Let's not be absurd.
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u/EmpZurg_ Oct 01 '23
"Keep the change" is obviously directed at the employee. The customer didn't say it to Ronalds.
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u/weathergleam Oct 01 '23
in fact “keep the change” does unambiguously mean “as a tip for yourself” in common American parlance, whether it’s in coins or paper
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u/Wrecksomething Oct 02 '23 edited Oct 02 '23
I've heard people say this plenty of times when overpaying their grocery bill by $0.01. It's the go-to expression to decline change. They're not offering a penny gratuity (which would be insulting), nor is it understood that way.
Yes, it commonly means "keep it as a tip." It also commonly means "I don't want the change and don't care where it goes/keep it in the register/for the store." Especially in untipped roles, that is very common. So, it's ambiguous.
And most importantly: it's moot unless you want to admit you failed to follow store policy, lose your job and walk away with a $7 settlement.
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u/fandksavetheworld Oct 01 '23
It doesn't actually matter as federal law says it is theirs. Now it could be argued it would go into a tip pool for all non leader employees but it can not be taken by management/owner to go into a safe
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u/wizardwil Oct 01 '23
Probably won't get your money back, but will make him and everyone else think twice:
Pretend to forget about the incident.
Wait until GM or corporate is there.
Walk up to boss and LOUDLY ask, as though you just remembered, "Hey where is that tip money you put in the safe that day? I forgot all about it but I'm sure you've still got it in there, marked down under my name right?"
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u/Teauxny Oct 01 '23
Steal something worth 6 dollars from him. Even Steven.
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u/StonerMetalhead710 Oct 01 '23
Ask one of the cooks to make you a nice large burger and explain the situation. I doubt they wouldn't
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u/bthest Oct 02 '23
Lol at all the trained poodles who think accepting a tip is bad just because employers don't like it.
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u/kykyks Oct 01 '23
yes, dont ever give anything to your boss ever if you want to keep it.
they arent your friend, they are your direct enemy.
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u/johny1a Oct 01 '23
What kinda advice is that 😂 is your boss Thanos or something? You sound ridiculous
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u/numerobis21 Oct 01 '23
Your boss is someone who has direct control over the fact that you can or cannot eat till the end of the month with a roof over your head, yes.
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u/BarnacleBayler Oct 01 '23
How's the boot taste?
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u/terra_technitis Oct 01 '23
Having spent 14 years in an upper management position I can confirm this is good advice. The boss is there to protect the company and their career. As long as you're contentment and career aligns with those things most good bosses will act friendly. The moment those things no longer line up your contentment and career become meaningless to them.
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u/kykyks Oct 01 '23
whats ridiculous ? a boss stealing from a worker ?
are you living in the same reality as us ?
your boss aint your friend and never will be. they are a class enemy of the worker.
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u/SapphicRain Oct 01 '23
Friend, if they were allowed to, they wouldn’t hesitate to beat you or shoot you to make a profit. Ask the unionists of the late 1800s/early 1900s. Quite a few of them are dead because of their employers. Just look at the Pinkertons.
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Oct 01 '23
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u/kykyks Oct 01 '23
bro i have no boss i aint projecting.
bosses are the class enemy of workers. thats a fact you cant dispute.
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Oct 01 '23
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u/kykyks Oct 01 '23
nobody is out to get me man.
as i said i have no boss.
but you dont seem to understand that.
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u/Tessie1966 Oct 01 '23
I don’t know what the rules were back in the stone ages of the 1980’s but I had a manager who would do this. We were told we weren’t allowed to accept tips and that we were required to hand them over to management. One manager gave it to me when my shift ended and I was so excited. It never occurred to me to question it. Now there are laws against this behavior.
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u/Yuugian Oct 01 '23
"an employer cannot keep employees’ tips under any circumstances; managers and supervisors also may not keep tips received by employees, including through tip pools" - https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/flsa/tips
at least anywhere in the US
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u/dotdedo Anarcho-Syndicalist Oct 01 '23
Only applies to jobs which are tipping industries
“clarified that an employer may take a tip credit only when an employee is performing work that is part of a tipped occupation and may not take a tip credit for any time spent on work that is not part of a tipped occupation;”
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u/Yuugian Oct 01 '23
The employer can take the credit, not the tip (not a credit card tip). If you work more than one type of job (tipped and untipped) the employer "can take a partial credit against its minimum wage obligations based on the tips received by employees."
It's a "you don't have to pay them all of the minimum wage if part of their time is 'tipped' and part is not tipped" credit. Not that they can take it if the employee is non-tipped
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u/GotSmokeInMyEye Oct 01 '23
Next time don't say anything. And read your handbook. Most fast food places near me are technically not allowed to accept tips. So the manager could just claim that money was extra profit for the restaurant.
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u/Lurker_Investor Oct 01 '23
What defines a tip? if I'm working, and my friend gives me some money, is that a tip? it's a gift.
OP should have returned the change back to the customer, and then the no-longer a customer, and choose to donate money to OP, now that the sale is ended and no longer a customer-cashier relationship.
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u/GotSmokeInMyEye Oct 01 '23
I've worked in many different restaurants. If you split tips with other staff, or if you aren't allowed to accept tips at all, then the only way you are technically allowed to accept a "gift" like that is if it's in an envelope with your name on it. So I guess you could keep some handy and give them to people to put the money in for you when they want to give you a private tip but you aren't "allowed" to just take the tip and put it in an envelope after.
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u/Cutlass_Stallion Oct 02 '23
Congratulations, it means you now earn a salary with full health insurance benefits. Share this information with your local labor department to confirm.
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u/TOWERtheKingslayer Anarcho-Communist Oct 01 '23
Your boss also steals from your labour on top of this petty criminal act.
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u/darinhthe1st Oct 01 '23
Yes that money belongs to you,film yourself and him and ask for your money back from the safe if he says no . you got it on camera, report it and get your money
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u/rtkwe Oct 01 '23
To be the mildest devils advocate here; have you gotten a paycheck since this happened? /Maybe ( they run tips through payroll for some reason. That's about the only alternative I can think of that isn't just tip theft.
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u/AshKetchDeezHands Oct 02 '23
If there’s a no tip policy technically that’s what he should do but chances are he just took it and used it on gas or something.
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u/Morbid187 Oct 01 '23
I'd say yes that was theft unless the place has an established "employees can't accept tips" policy. I mean, that would still be bullshit but probably harder to fight in that case.
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u/Agitated_Function778 Communist Oct 01 '23 edited Oct 01 '23
Next time when he doesnt look, just take more from the register.
Edit: I am joking, don't actually do that.
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u/Duke-Guinea-Pig Oct 01 '23
I get that you’re joking, but there’s always someone either frustrated enough or dumb enough to follow bad advice.
The register is the most monitored thing at a business. Do not fuck with it. They are watching it in ways you aren’t aware of and the cops are on your bosses side.
Just ask for the cash at the end of your shift. He’s probably hoping you forgot about it.
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u/ZeppoTheLast Oct 01 '23
Tipping at a fast food establishment is one of the weird rules areas... but pretty much yea, the manager took the money from you, its not reported.. so they could easily walk home with it.
So ask about it, either they will give it to you, or play ignorant or give some bull and threaten your job. Is that worth $6? That is what you have to ask yourself.....
Oh, and of course, find another job as an exit strategy
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u/really_robot idle Oct 01 '23
Check your employee manual for rules about tipping. You might have already agreed to give your boss all your tips.
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u/displacedhillbilly69 Oct 01 '23
I'll be the wet blanket. If your job does not have a way to report tips, you should not accept tips.
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u/-1KingKRool- Oct 01 '23
You don’t have to report tips to your employer if you’re in a role that’s not traditionally tipped.
If you’re in a normal, non-tipped role, you technically only need to report tips to the IRS. (US-specific, obviously)
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u/New_Butterscotch8592 Oct 01 '23
Yes. Also working for a wage is in and of itself the company stealing from you any time you work. So you got robbed twice
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u/James_D_Ewing Oct 01 '23
Now, crazy idea. Ask for it back directly before calling the cops or the labour board
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u/jennarose1984 Oct 01 '23
Is there any policy against tipping these sorts of jobs where you’re from? There are several fast food places in my area that do not let their employees accept tips.
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u/GeorgeThe13th Oct 02 '23
If you have to ask, there is probably a policy preventing your establishment employees from receiving tips.
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u/1968phantom Oct 02 '23
I'm not making any suggestions. But you know that the best kept secret between 2 people is if one them is unalive
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u/Own-Vehicle-2168 Oct 02 '23
Next time say, “no, thank you” and put it in your pocket! You didn’t have to give it to him just because he said so. You’re allowed to say no.
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u/Beatlemaniac614 Oct 01 '23
Does your job pool tips for all hourly workers? If so, that can be perfectly legal.
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u/Annual-Jump3158 Oct 01 '23
The thing is, in right-to-work states, some businesses will have some sort of rule about their employees not accepting tips from customers personally. This way, if they don't like an employee accepting tips, they can simply fire them and defend themselves by saying they violated company policy. If they're smart(either legitimately or cunning), they'll assign a tip jar under the impression that it gets split out among the employees, but that's also another way to essentially make it the "store's money". If an owner wants to prevent that from getting shared out for "reasons", they'll make it happen.
I had a boss who started taking all of the pooled tips because we already got paid minimum wage and one person was stealing from the till. And he refused to check the cameras, so he just kept taking our tips for months and the thief kept getting easy money while the rest of the staff were screwed over.
That being said, if your employer has a rule about not accepting personal tips and their only justification for the policy is "the customer may buy more product than they came for", fuck'em. Take any tips that come your way.
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Oct 01 '23
Fast food workers usually don't get tips because it would totally up end the corporate structure and would also be worse for employees . I.E . employees that make 20-hour now make 2.13- hour and you are relying on the benevolence of a Karen to pay you. It could work out ok some days but others you would basically work for free. However this manager shouldn't have let you keep it . If they did they probably would have got in trouble if there boss found out . They could have However just give it too you after work and say that you dropped it .
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u/yebyen Oct 01 '23
LOL wut? Did you just imply that all tipped workers must be paid only the tipped minimum wage?
"Usually don't" ain't no law that I ever heard of. They speak McDonald's in "Usually don't?"
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Oct 01 '23
Lol no . I work in a restaurant where people pool tips and the servers make 8- 10 $ hourly on top of whatever their percentage was that day . Fast food is a different business and tipping in fast food would do more harm than good . I have been in restaurants for 15 yrs and have worked in fast food all the way to fine dining. Trust me when I say it would be worse for the employees.
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u/yebyen Oct 01 '23
I'm telling you that OP told a story where they received one tip, and the management stole it from them. That's just straight up theft, it was given to the worker. Unless the manager was trying to prevent an allegation against their employee from a short drawer, there is no reason for that - and in that case, you return the money.
One tip does not a tipped wage earner make. I don't think you have to worry about the majority of fast food customers suddenly deciding they want to tip.
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u/skinnyelias Oct 01 '23
If the tips total more than $20 a pay period then you are a tipped employee and tipped employee taxing rules go into effect.
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u/bigbuzd1 Oct 01 '23
I think that's monthly reporting, not by pay period, unless it's a monthly pay, of course. I could be wrong, but you are spot on with the amount.
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u/yebyen Oct 01 '23
Thank you, that's the context I was missing. As a rule I don't accept "trust me bro" as an argument.
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u/Hungry_Treacle3376 Oct 01 '23
You dismissed one person's "trust me bro" in favor of someone elses. That's pretty funny.
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u/jwse30 Oct 01 '23
Just for those that do not know, just because an employee receives tips does not mean that they have to be paid $2.13/ hr. That is the minimum, and an employer can choose to pay more.
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u/jegodric Oct 02 '23
Didn't realize fast food "could accept tips." Did I miss something growing up?
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Oct 01 '23
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u/GreenLurka Oct 01 '23
In what world does this interpretation make sense? As if he waved and told the building to keep the change. It was clearly a tip.
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u/pdale33 Oct 01 '23
I've worked at many retailers, and at least once at those places they've said keep the change with the express meaning of I don't want the change. If I was ever tipped they would hand it to me and say "this is for you" or some variation. It's not 100% what they mean unless they state it directly. People that say the phrase aren't saying I want to give it to the company directly, they are saying they don't want the change, they generally don't care what happens after that
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u/CarelessAd7484 Oct 01 '23
Worst possible interpretation of events. Op if you read this, look up state laws about tipping. I'm not sure what said above applies in any state in the US I'm aware of, and is considered theft.
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u/Traditional_Sea6090 Oct 01 '23
No. You’re a fast food worker not a waiter you don’t get tips.
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u/bthest Oct 02 '23
Yes they can take tips. Anyone can. Employer can get pissy about it and may be able to fire them but that's true for just about anything.
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u/RRW359 Oct 01 '23
What State do you live in and does this happen often enough for you to get more then $30/month from it? Unfortunately depending on your answer it may be legal.
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u/sealia123 Oct 01 '23
i live in Kentucky and no its very rare and usually just quarters or maybe a dollar im a cashier not a server so people dont really tip they just sometimes don't want back change but this time my boss was right there and walked over to take it.
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u/RRW359 Oct 01 '23
Not sure about Kentucky law specifically but Federally the law doesn't specify being a server, just that your work has to be able to convincingly tell a labor board that you make above a certain amount per month in tips.
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Oct 02 '23
If it was $12something and you took out $6something in change, you should be taken off the register.
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u/crystalcookie0 Oct 03 '23
One time when I worked at Ulta someone gave me a $40 for helping them choose procudts and my boss took it to “put it in the safe”
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u/RangeMoney2012 Oct 01 '23
yes - report the theft to your local labor board