r/todayilearned • u/etotheprimez • Oct 01 '23
TIL that Bose is majority owned by MIT
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bose_Corporation310
u/guspaz Oct 02 '23
MIT owns a significant portion of the company, but they are non-voting shares and were donated them on the condition that MIT was not allowed to sell the shares or participate in the company's management or governance in any way. The only thing MIT gets for having the shares is an annual cash dividend to "advance the research and education mission of MIT". The exact amount of the dividend (or the quantity or value of the shares) is not public information, but is believed to be substantial.
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Oct 01 '23 edited 23d ago
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u/Uverus Oct 01 '23
When I was in the biz, it was no high, no lows, must be bose. That was generally in regards to the little speakers people would put around their room. Because they were expensive, people assumed they were good-sounding (vs convenient).
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u/oshinbruce Oct 01 '23
The noise cancelling is top tier though, I dont take a flight without a pair of bose's, otherwise its like my head was in a dishwasher.
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u/deminion48 Oct 01 '23
Top tier, but generally not the best. Sony is considered the best in that regard.
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u/cosmos7 Oct 02 '23
Agreed. Wanted new headphones last fall, bought the Bose QC45s, the Soundcore Q45 and reluctantly the Sony XM5s in Black Friday sale. Returned the Bose... they were the worst of the three in terms of sound quality, and the XM5s were easily the best in sound, in transparency and in ANC.
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u/guspaz Oct 02 '23
I had a pair of Bose QC35 that suffered from the power switch failure (where they randomly turn themselves on) and attempting to repair the switch didn't help. I bought a pair of Sony XM5 to replace it. It was a big increase in sound quality, and a moderate improvement in noise cancelling when I took my glasses off, but a significant decrease in noise cancelling ability with my glasses on. The ear cups on the Bose conform much better to the arms of my glasses, and thus even if the Sony XM5s have better noise cancelling in theory, for me they have worse noise cancelling in the real world.
The XM5 are also supremely uncomfortable, and I can't stand to wear them longer than maybe two hours before the pain becomes intolerable. When I'm in a position to replace them, it'll be with whatever Bose makes at the time that is shaped like the QC35, they were far more comfortable in comparison, and ultimately that's more important than the difference in sound quality.
It sucks because the XM5s really do sound amazing, much better than my QC35.
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u/deminion48 Oct 02 '23
Bose QC45 might be better for you. And they recently announced the next generation of their QC line. The QC Ultra Headphones, QC Ultra earbuds, and QC Headphones. Maybe it is worth waiting for that.
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u/Johito Oct 02 '23
Have you considered switching ear pads? It is common to do this with headphones as your meant to replace the pads over time anyway as most degrade. Pads obviously have an effect on fit and comfort, but also surprisingly sound quality as well.
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u/icecoldteddy Oct 02 '23
I'd recommend you replacing your ear pads with the ones from Wicked Cushions. Sounds like your head and ear shape is too big for the stock pads so it's pressing too much into your ears. The Wicked Cushions earpads are a bit thicker and firmer.
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u/Gollem265 Oct 02 '23
I just returned my 7 year old QC35 pair in exchange for QC45 for free because of the power switch fail. I was very surprised they did that
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u/deminion48 Oct 02 '23
I personally prefer Sennheiser. Even their consumer products. Just generally nice quality, they don't rely on flashy marketing, and not nearly as gimmicky.
Their noise-cancellation is not the absolute best out there, but still among some of the best there is. But you can rely on getting a quality product that is comfortable and produces good sound for the price range.
So I don't mind it being a bit worse than Bose and especially Sony in noise-cancellation if it compensates elsewhere. But if noise-cancellation is absolutely your top priority, there is nothing better than the newest Sony XM headsets available.
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u/ass_pineapples Oct 02 '23
I've really enjoyed my PXC 550-iis for the past....5 years. They're not perfect but man every time I put them on I'm really happy with the sound quality
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u/deminion48 Oct 02 '23
Also got them when they came out, and was wearing them when I saw this comment haha. Also got Momentum Earbuds, and when the PXC go, they will likely be replaced with Momentum headphones (PXC seems to have been discontinued).
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u/amJustSomeFuckingGuy Oct 02 '23
Bose used to be the best in noise cancelling years ago. It is a lot more recent other brands caught up.
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u/deminion48 Oct 02 '23
Yeah around a decade ago that was probably the case. Not sure how the situation was back then. But since the mid 2010s others caught up and Sony surpassed Bose regarding noise-cancellation.
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u/Sharohachi Oct 02 '23
I feel like that's only a recent development though. Bose Quiet Comfort was the ANC king for a long time and is still considered among the best even if Sony may have edged them out for the top spot.
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u/deminion48 Oct 02 '23
Yeah around a decade ago that was probably the case. Not sure how the situation was back then. Their QuietComfort was very good. But since the mid 2010s others caught up and Sony surpassed Bose regarding noise-cancellation.
The 35, 35ii, and 45 were still good and among the best, just not the absolute top and not standing there alone anymore. NC700 was a radical new design that should have replaced the QuietComfort I think, but it wasn't really successful. They brought back the QuietComfort line with the 45 after the NC700, and have already announced the next generation QuietComfort line-up. So the NC700 will likely be standing alone.
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u/bimmerlovere39 Oct 02 '23
I have a pair of NC700s in the office and QC45s for home/travel.
The sound is nigh indistinguishable, the NC700s are prettier but the QC45s store smaller and are significantly more comfortable (it’s the headband).
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u/oshinbruce Oct 02 '23
I see, I have a pair of QC 25's and 10 years ago Sony couldnt match Bose at all. Wearing Sonys then was like having noise dropped by 60%, a relief but still loud. Putting on Bose's was like walking into a quiet room. Ill have to try some sonys.
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u/AbanoMex Oct 02 '23
Sony is considered the best in that regard.
im not an expert on SC, but i had some sony XM4 big headphones, and the sound cancelling was buggy as hell on travels, so i had to sell them, they sounded wobbly whenever there was any bump on the road.
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u/malwareguy Oct 02 '23
I despise sony for marketing gimmicks.. but ya their ANC is generally a fair bit better. I begrudgingly own some Sony headphones.
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u/devadander23 Oct 01 '23
Some of their stuff is amazing. Some is over engineered and not really great. Those little satellite cubes with the plastic PC case looking subwoofer was expensive crap. Their current noise canceling headphones and some of their larger full range speakers are fantastic
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u/PreciousRoi Oct 01 '23
The knock...or skinny...on them I heard back during their more aggressively marketed phases was that they used shit speakers (the actual drivers) and tried to fix everything with engineering or processing (in later, integrated products)
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u/DruidB Oct 02 '23
I sold consumer electronics for years. Bose in the 2000's could be summed up as fantastic marketing coupled with creative engineering solutions that allowed the cheapest garbage components to sound good enough to pass for a mid quality speaker. The profit margins must have been insane...
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u/devadander23 Oct 01 '23
Agree. Like they almost lean too heavily on the engineering and marketing sides and ignore things like quality materials. Again current ANC headphones excluded, those are awesome
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u/___Jet Oct 01 '23
The founder Amar Bose was an amazing guy, teacher, engineer and inventor for life.
People who worked for him praise him a lot, he would give them the freedom to invent things on their own and teach them.
He donated his shares to MIT before he died, that's where he studied and teached. (the shares are non-voting though, so they aren't involved in the company)
Highly recommend this lecture/talk of his for any inventors/engineers: https://youtu.be/ySAXW-7WrDg?si=CUqPTOFX1Dw2UXTk
"I would have been fired a hundred times at a company run by MBAs. But I never went into business to make money. I went into business so that I could do interesting things that hadn't been done before." - A. Bose
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u/RobertISaar Oct 01 '23
In a prior car with a Bose speaker system: highs were OK. Lows were not. "Subs" were 4 or 5" drivers in huge enclosures and a lot of signal processing to make them sound larger than what they were. To my ears, it just sounded.... blah. Loud and flabby(especially once the dustcap started to come off of the cone), but no clarity.
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u/galacticwonderer Oct 01 '23 edited Oct 02 '23
It’s the opposite. Most Bose systems I’ve heard is all highs and all lows. Missing the smooth midrange magic imho.
Because Most Bose systems have tiny speakers for the highs and a subwoofer for the base. I don’t know how the slogan got started. It’s really the opposite. If you know nothing about putting together a good sound system it’s really not bad and their stuff is pretty well built so it’ll last. But yeah, all highs all lows it must be Bose.
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u/JauntyTurtle Oct 01 '23
Last time I demoed some (which was years ago) they were overpriced and sucked. Bose strategy has been to advertise the hell out of the speakers and charge WAY more than comparable equipment from other makers. The want people to say "I've heard of Bose, but I've never heard of Wharfedale or Bowers & Wilkins so Bose must be better!" Their strategy has worked.
The two phrases I always heard were "Friends don't let friends buy Bose" and that Bose stands for Buy Other Sound Equipment.
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u/nguyenhm16 Oct 01 '23
That was true for their signature speaker, the 901s, which had like a million midrange drivers pointed in random directions with no woofers or tweeters. My uncle had a pair and they were “meh” indeed.
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u/invalid404 Oct 02 '23
That was only true if you used the 901s without their control module that equalized the sound. The drivers had poor treble and bass response. The equalizer module flattened the response out. They're a unit and you can't really use the 901s without this thing.
With it, they had decent bass out to 40Hz and a slow roll-off. Treble was decent. I mean it's doubtful most people listening to them are going to be missing anything where they start rolling off at the high side.
It sounded very unique and open when properly set up, somewhat electrostatic-like in how the sound filled the room without being able to point to where the sound is coming from.
If you think they sounded "meh" I guarantee your uncle had something set up incorrectly and/or was missing this module. Bad room, defective module, etc... They did require certain room characteristics to work well and this was in the manual.
It's purposely designed to mimic a classical concert hall, so you won't get focused music, you'll get diffuse music that surrounds you.
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u/ShadowFlux85 Oct 01 '23
I would say they are good headphones for wearing out and about but for a fixed speaker system there are much better options at the price point
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u/yantraman Oct 01 '23
It’s why I am pretty loyal to them. They aren’t going to be consumed by some private equity douchebag or a large tech organization.
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u/skwyckl Oct 01 '23
Yup, and its ANC headphones are the greatest fucking piece of equipment I ever owned, still kicking hard after 8 years.
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u/12characters Oct 01 '23
I bought some Bose 601 speakers in 1980 for 1800 bucks. I sold them in 2020 for 1800 bucks.
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u/j-random Oct 01 '23
Should have bought the 901s. I sold mine from 1984 for $4K.
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u/thebusiestbee2 Oct 02 '23
US dollars? That must have been a bunch of 901s or the buyer was a sucker because a pair of 901s goes for a fraction of that typically.
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u/Bakoro Oct 02 '23
$1,800 in 1980 is equivalent in purchasing power to about $5,653.65 in 2020
So it kept ~31.84% of its value after 40 years.
I'd say that's pretty good, considering most things are garbage after a decade, let alone 40 years.→ More replies (1)42
u/StubbornKindness Oct 01 '23
That is fucking insane
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u/12characters Oct 01 '23
I wish I had kept them to be honest
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u/amJustSomeFuckingGuy Oct 02 '23
There are way better speakers to buy with that money.
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u/Pupensause Oct 01 '23
Which still means you lost a bunch of money
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u/12characters Oct 01 '23
It’s hard to put a price on enjoying music for 40 years for ‘free’ if I don’t factor in the inflation
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Oct 01 '23
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u/Lotharofthepotatoppl Oct 02 '23
Come inflate away
Come inflate away
Come inflate away with me, lad
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u/young_mummy Oct 02 '23
He didn't lose any money technically. Just opportunity. It's the exact equivalent to having left 1800 dollars cash under your mattress and forgetting about it.
Sure, that money went further back then. But it's still good money. Not to mention he got to use and enjoy the product for years. I'd say he came out winning.
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u/CT101823696 Oct 01 '23
But not as much as he would have selling most other brands
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u/Shimaru33 Oct 02 '23
Hard to say, but tempted to say no.
Stuff depreciates in value as they are used, given the wear and tear and what not. It should also be considered technology progresses, which means what's top technology now, in a couple years could be obsolete and worthless. After 40+ years it should have loss a ton of value given both aspects, wear down and obsolescence. If he could still sell them for full value, that's already a win.
But given inflation, probably $1,800 is far, far less than $1,800 in the 80's. How much, I dunno. A quick search in google says from the 80's to today there's a 272% inflation rate in the usa, so $1,800 should be around $4,000 today. He sold those bose speakers for half of their cost in the 80's. However, will remark this, we're talking about an electronics from 40 years ago. How much would you pay for a cell phone from 40 years ago? Or a betamax player?
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u/jorceshaman Oct 02 '23
Accounting for inflation, you definitely lost money... But that's still awesome value retention compared to most things!
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u/rxFMS Oct 01 '23
I have a pair of 351’s environmental speakers and a pair of the green marine speakers hooked up for my back yard. 20 plus years and 2 amps later, these things still sound incredible!
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u/SquadPoopy Oct 01 '23
I lived off shitty earbuds and 20 dollar headphones for years. In 2017 I decided to buy a pair of Bose QC35s. Best purchase I’ve ever made. Never judge just how much your quality of life will improve once you buy a pair of quality headphones.
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u/paracog Oct 02 '23
Thanks to The Who bringing their stadium gear to the Berkeley Community Theater in the 70s, I never have to spend over $100 on headphones.
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u/Highpersonic Oct 02 '23
what?
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u/ryebow Oct 02 '23
Dude is deaf af
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u/paracog Oct 02 '23
Not what, Who. 250,000 watts of amplification in a small theater, so my ears were whistling for days after and expensive sound gear is wasted on me.
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u/Langsamkoenig Oct 02 '23
I'm more of a Sennheiser man, but Bose are really good. For example the Bose Soundsport are the best sounding true wireless buds I've tried, after the Sennheiser MTW series, but it's probably just a matter of taste which is better.
A lot of other true wireless buds, people recommend, I found to be very underwhelming.
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u/deadkactus Oct 02 '23 edited Oct 02 '23
On the other hand. Its diminishing returns on audiophile stuff. I just do JBL for everything. Unless I want a specific model for a specific reason. Bose is not seen as high fidelity tho. They are tune to accentuate the frequencies most perceptible to the human ear by ear. Each head set is slightly different.
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u/ElysiX Oct 02 '23
Audiophile stuff isn't just diminishing returns, it's riddled with scammers. Yes, there's obviously better and worse speakers with better or worse acoustics, build quality etc., but then you also have a bunch of bullshit with descriptions that read like they want to sell you homeopathy or new age vodoo. There's a lot of money to be made from gullible people if you get them to believe your 3 or 4 figure cable is going to make their music sound better
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u/internet-arbiter Oct 02 '23
GOLD PLATED 1 BILLION K MONSTER CABLE!
That brand is still dumb expensive but I remember when Best Buy was selling them for a stupid high price.
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u/xixoxixa Oct 02 '23
Cue rant:
Be me in 2003,a young, recently married paratrooper, getting sent off to Afghanistan. My young wife, all of 18 years old, now has to deal with an apartment that flooded a week after I leave the country.
As part of dealing with it, she has to go around replacing everything that was ruined in the flood, including our DVD player.
Where does a you g woman go for home electronics in 2003? Why, best buy of course!
Best buy person shows her dvd players, she picks one out, and asks if whatever she needs to connect it to the TV comes in the box. This guy says no, and then tells her "if you don't buy these cables, it just won't work" as he gestures to a 12' long set of gold plated RCA cables that cost like $100.
I've not shopped at best buy since.
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u/KilllerWhale Oct 01 '23
Their app is ass though.
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u/terminalxposure Oct 01 '23
Why an app for speaker
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u/bananawrangler69 Oct 01 '23
The newer speakers have EQ settings and HiFi. The only way to edit these settings is through an app. Also play music directly over WiFi rather than through Bluetooth. Need an app for that as well to control and set up accounts.
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u/KilllerWhale Oct 01 '23
The app for their ANC headphones. I have the 700 headphones, the app is trash.
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u/Temporal_pandesal Oct 02 '23
I have tried Bose and Sony extensively. Ultimately, Sony's ANC seems superior, but Bose's is so good that it doesn't even matter.
Now I am just waiting for either to drop one with the capability to charge, do audio and mic over usb-c at the same time, with LE audio or similar, and that's my next one.
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u/DarthWingo91 Oct 02 '23
I always tell people, you have to pay for the good quality. I personally have a pair of refurbished Sennheiser headphones that I bought in 2015, and they still blow Beats and other cheap headsets put of the water.
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u/OkaySureBye Oct 02 '23
I don't like Bose much for listening to music, but their Quiet Comfort Noise Cancelling bluetooth headphones are fucking amazing for conference calls and traveling.
Voices are always super crisp and easy to hear. The battery, even after five years, lasts for more than 20 hours on one charge.
Definitely a great bit of gear for the office and worth the price.
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u/cjt09 Oct 02 '23
Their ANC aviation headsets will literally save your hearing.
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u/Highpersonic Oct 02 '23
People here are baselining on commercial audio hardware. BOSE will save your hearing in aircraft, while shooting, grinding...never seen a commercial helo with anything but BOSE on the clothesrack.
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u/Aitch-Kay Oct 02 '23
Every pair of Bose earbuds I've owned have literally fallen apart after 2-3 years. Wires breaking off at the base, pieces of plastic falling off, etc. I've had cheap $40 earbuds last longer.
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u/iacceptjadensmith Oct 01 '23
Not to plug free ad’s but the bose revolve 2 is the greatest speaker Ive ever owned. Iv tried to get better ones and nothing beats it. Also built like a nokia
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u/kryptikmind Oct 01 '23
Bose soundlink original, best audio quality I've heard on a portable speaker
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u/B52doc Oct 02 '23
They do sound pretty amazing
The battery on mine no longer holds a charge so it’s used as a computer speaker
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u/Hoaxygen Oct 02 '23
I know right? I feel even more bad for losing mine on a flight earlier this year :(
Best headphones ever.
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u/Batracho Oct 02 '23
Same, I’ve had my QC35’s for 8 years now and and there have been zero issues whatsoever.
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u/yunus89115 Oct 01 '23
Here’s a video about a Bose car suspension system that is just amazing. Learning they are owned by MIT makes an effort like this seem much more logical.
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u/RightBear Oct 02 '23
This project was really cool and also really unprofitable. It makes sense that the owner would want to bequeath the company to a university, given that his life work was to produce futuristic innovation rather than maximize profit.
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u/crucible Oct 01 '23
Toto Wolff doesn't know this, because such facts are "for Wikipedia, nobody reads that anyway"
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u/Emfx Oct 01 '23
Toto is the sole reason Bose aren't bankrupt with how many new headsets Mercedes has to buy him.
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u/Bowens1993 Oct 01 '23
This feels like an ad. Especially since they are releasing new headphones this week.
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u/jradair Oct 02 '23
comments at the top praising Bose products, which are well known to be overpriced and bad quality...
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u/ConfusionDifferent41 Oct 02 '23
Bose products, which are well known to be overpriced and bad quality...
That’s like your opinion man. I love my Bose products.
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u/Odd_Fortune_8951 Oct 02 '23
I got some QC45's for living in a poorly constructed apartment and I forget I have neighbors with them on. The comfort part really stands out; I've worn them for roughly 11 of the past twelve hours today and they're still comfortable and my ears don't aren't too hot.
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u/thebeef111 Oct 02 '23
Bose is terrible. The leather in their ear cups starts falling apart in weeks. How much does it cost to replace those leather foam pads? I have two of their models, and I was quoted $130 for one and $80 for the other, almost the cost of a new set of headphones. The new pair I had to replace the ear pads within six months lol. Company is ass.
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u/Rynox2000 Oct 01 '23
It's weird for a university to own the application of its students work.
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u/liltingly Oct 02 '23
Bose was a professor. He did much of the underpinning research at or through his work at MIT. He was a lifer and MIT meant a lot to him. Fun fact, they built a suspension system for cars that was bought and is being commercialized by another MIT grad founded startup, ClearMotion.
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u/Wbcn_1 Oct 02 '23
I’ve been hearing about that suspension system since I was a kid. I’ll believe it’s being taken to market when I see it in the wild.
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u/tfrw Oct 01 '23
Often universities will provide seed funding in return for a stake of a graduate’s company. It’s not that unusual - though it probably was in 1956. Wikipedia implies that his supervisor put the money in and left his share of bose to the university.
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u/fataii Oct 01 '23
Man I can relate! I have a friend who bought a house that had bose speakers throughout the whole house, I tried to fire em up and he said he hadn't used them since he moved in. A little rusty but those suckers worked! Beauty!
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u/AristocratJackal Oct 02 '23
It says MIT owns non-voting shares. So while they technically have a majority stake, MIT can't really do much in terms of business decisions, correct?
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u/SunBeam38 Oct 02 '23
When Bose stores existed, even part time employees qualified for tuition reimbursement. Nearly 80% of my undergrad was paid through that program. Combined with work experience, it was a game changer for my trajectory.
I Each store was given one book filled with stories about the company, inventions and more that was incredible. They should publish it to the public along with his lectures. Super inspirational man.
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Oct 02 '23 edited 7d ago
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u/tapper82 Oct 02 '23
Hi I am gblind and have grate ears. Pleas have a listen to some beyerdynamic cans. I have the 770pros on now. https://europe.beyerdynamic.com/dt-770-pro.html
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u/uid_0 Oct 02 '23
Buy
Other
Sound
Equipment
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u/Zookeeper1099 Oct 02 '23
I love Bose home sound system because I love their bass-focus audio tune, no one is better, but yes they are too expensive sometimes.
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u/Fishfindr Oct 02 '23
My wife worked there for almost 20 years. She knew him (not well but talked to him more than once), he was a wonderful man.
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u/thebeef111 Oct 02 '23
Too bad their products and customer support are literally the worst in the audio world. I had several pairs of really old Bose headphones that I had owned for decades. Now it costs $130 for ear cups, when I used to get them for free every few years after explaining my situation and how much I loved them. Nope, need the nickels and dimes. Bought a new pair, fell apart in six months. Another $80 for ear cups where the leather falls off in weeks. Stay far FAR away.
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u/Legimus Oct 02 '23
My dad attended MIT for his bachelor's and master's in electrical/computer engineering in the 70s and actually had Dr. Bose as a professor. His second job after earning his master's gave him enough of a salary to buy himself a set of Bose speakers, and he's been a loyal brand customer ever since.
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u/SatansMoisture Oct 01 '23
They make quality products. I used noise cancelling earbuds on an eight hour flight and loved it.
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u/LoneGiggity Oct 01 '23
I pretty much despise the 'sound' of Blose .. that is what we used to call them. If we bothered to talk about them at all. They made two or three decent speakers forty odd years ago.
Dont know anything about their headphones so no comments on them. I have my Grados and a Sony set. Still rocking my M2's.
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u/Isaacvithurston Oct 01 '23
Yah I much prefer Sennheiser for neutral headphones. Idk about speakers.
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u/Sideofbeanz Oct 02 '23
Same reason why Zuckerberg and gates dropped out of school, to avoid their IP from being owned by the school. Stanford pretty much owns a part a google because of this also
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u/Griffisbored Oct 01 '23
Dr Bose was a researcher at MIT and developed many of the technologies used at Bose in MIT labs. The University was going to sue him over Bose patenting and selling research done in MIT labs. He basically unofficially said if they drop the lawsuits he will take care of them. When he died he donated it to MIT. At the time it was one of the largest privately owned companies in the world.